BRITAIN will not open its borders to migrants fleeing the turmoil in North Africa, the Home Secretary has insisted.

BRITAIN will not open its borders to migrants fleeing the turmoil in North Africa, the Home Secretary has insisted.

Theresa May told her EU counterparts that the UK was not prepared to take on any “burden sharing”.

Ms May issued her warning at a meeting of Europe’s Home Affairs ministers in response to calls for help from Italy.

She did however offer “practical assistance” to Italy on its own shores.

A Home Office spokesman said: “We were quite robust in stating that we are not planning to open our borders to those coming to Europe from North Africa. We do not agree with ‘burden sharing’ which is what Italy wants.”

More than 25,000, mainly Tunisians, have arrived in Italy since the unrest there and thousands of Libyans, Egyptians and other Africans are expected to make the crossing as border controls in war-torn Libya fail.

The tiny Sicilian island of Lampedusa is swamped by thousands of migrants arriving by the boatload every day.

Read more: http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/242430/UK-is-closed-to-war-refugees-UK-is-closed-to-war-refugees-#ixzz1KL3ABrxE

I believe the lady is delusional here.

You think she is delusional why? Is this not the sort of statement you'd prefer?

eilzel wrote:You think she is delusional why? Is this not the sort of statement you'd prefer?

Because BY LAW we have to take them Eilzel don't we? So why is she saying that? Surely not because she is trying to fool the public. A Tory lying, really, what a shock.

I think I'm right in saying that we do not have to take them Seren. We have to take citizens of EU countries as part of the EU agreement was free movement of labour, but these people are not EU citizens.

sassy1261 wrote:I think I'm right in saying that we do not have to take them Seren. We have to take citizens of EU countries as part of the EU agreement was free movement of labour, but these people are not EU citizens.

Once they get given temporary EU visas - which France and Italy will be doling out to them - they are then free to wander to whichever EU country they wish. They will head of course to the country that offers the best benefits which as ours of course.

Have you read about the latest large Ethiopian family being housed by your taxes at a cost of £1400 a week.

Is Ethiopia in the EU sassy? How can you explain their current arrangements?

Admin wrote:

Once they get given temporary EU visas - which France and Italy will be doling out to them - they are then free to wander to whichever EU country they wish. They will head of course to the country that offers the best benefits which as ours of course.

Have you read about the latest large Ethiopian family being housed by your taxes at a cost of £1400 a week.

Is Ethiopia in the EU sassy? How can you explain their current arrangements?

I can't, its stupid and reinforces division. The only thing that occured to me was that there was a large number of them, not sure how many, but by housing them all together perhaps they saved money. Then again, perhaps they didn't and the authority concerned are just stupid! Are you sure about the temporary visas? I thought that the person had to stay in the country they were granted the visa in until it was made permanent and they became citizens, a visa does not give you citizenship.

sassy1261 wrote:

I can't, its stupid and reinforces division. The only thing that occured to me was that there was a large number of them, not sure how many, but by housing them all together perhaps they saved money. Then again, perhaps they didn't and the authority concerned are just stupid! Are you sure about the temporary visas? I thought that the person had to stay in the country they were granted the visa in until it was made permanent and they became citizens, a visa does not give you citizenship.

Keep switching accounts sorry.

See everybody thinks that too. But if you actually read more about the EU and how being a member binds us to so many laws and treaties you'll see how much of what people think about visas are incorrect.

There are sites out there beyond searchlight. Sites like migrationwatch etc and yes even the EU itself which give an honest appraisal of what we in Britain are signed up to regarding asylum seekers. If you can recall back on Sky both Allakaka and myself regularly tried to tell people of exactly what asylum seekers were entitled to under EU law. And you remember the reaction that we received. I appreciate that everyone wishes to show compassion to people fleeing a war zone but seriously how can you watch services being cut to the poorest in our society whilst we hand out thousands a week to so very many asylum seekers.

I sincerely hope one day you see sassy that many of us are not racist, xenophobes at all but realize that Britain is no longer in a position financially to do this, that's all.

Interestingly France is debating whether to just suspend its membership of the Schengen visa free European travel system that it signed up to. (I think the Amsterdam treaty was signed back in 1999 but I could be wrong) due to the thousands of asylum seekers sweeping in from Libya and Tunisia.

A diplomatic row has broken out as France accuses Italy of breaking the spirit of the Schengen Visa Free system by doling out thousands of temporary EU visas allowing travel and temporary EU residency to their new non-EU "guests". These "guests" are now making their way to France for its beneficial welfare system which armed with their temporary EU visas they are now of course entitled to.

Don't you just love the way that France just drops out of any treaty or agreement it has signed up to, whenever they feel like it?

France seeks change to Schengen border agreement

France has called for an easier mechanism to temporarily suspend an agreement which allows freedom of movement across 25 European countries.



The move follows an influx of migrants from Tunisia and Libya into Italy.

Italy's decision to grant Tunisians 20,000 temporary residence permits, allowing free travel in the passport-free Schengen zone, has angered France.

Last week, French officials temporarily stopped trains with migrants crossing the border from Italy into France.

The decision sparked anger between Italy and France, with Italy accusing its neighbour of overstepping the treaty on border-free travel.

Exceptional circumstances

In an off-the-record but widely-reported briefing, a senior French official said: "The governance of Schengen is failing. It seems there is a need to reflect on a mechanism that will allow a temporary suspension of the agreement, in case of a systemic failure of an external (EU) border."

The official, at the presidential Elysee Palace, said that any such an intervention would be provisional, until any "weakness" in the system was corrected.

The BBC's Hugh Schofield, in Paris, says that this is a highly controversial idea, deliberately floated by the French government just before the Easter break when any reaction from Brussels will inevitably be slow in coming.

Suspension of the agreement is permitted under the Schengen Pact, but only in the case of a "grave threat to the public order or internal security".

Under the current agreement, in these exceptional circumstances, border controls can only initially be reintroduced for a maximum of 30 days.

Mr Sarkozy is due to address the problem of migrants entering France through Italy when he meets Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi on Tuesday in Rome.

Earlier this month, Italy and France agreed to launch sea and air patrols to try to prevent the influx of thousands of people from Tunisia, Egypt and Libya.

Many Tunisians have close ties with France - a former colonial power - with friends and relatives in French cities.

Much moaning from France here whilst Germany takes a tougher stance...

Refugees are 'Italy's problem,' minister says



Interior Minister Hans-Peter Friedrich stepped up the war of words with Italy over asylum-seekers Monday, telling the Italian government the boatloads of people arriving in Lampedusa were their problem.

As European Union ministers prepared to meet in Luxembourg Monday, an open argument between the European neighbours broke out over the weekend regarding the thousands of African asylum seekers arriving on the tiny Italian island.

“Italy must sort out its refugee problem itself,” Friedrich, of the Bavarian conservatives the Christian Social Union, told Monday’s edition of daily Die Welt.

At least 22,000 asylum-seekers have arrived by boat on Lampedusa - which is Europe's most southern point - since political upheavals began to rock North Africa in January, eventually engulfing Tunisia, Egypt and Libya. Most of the asylum-seekers are from Tunisia.

Italy is arguing that the problem should be tackled by Europe as a whole and that it simply has the geographical misfortune of having the most southern-lying piece of territory. It has issued the asylum-seekers with temporary residency permits that allow them to travel to other EU countries.

On Sunday, Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi said the situation was “not an Italian problem but a European (problem)," and even hinted at separating from the union.

“Europe is either something real and concrete, or it doesn’t exist. In that case, it is better if we separate and each follows his own fears and selfish concerns,” he said.

But under EU law, the country in which asylum-seekers land must deal with their refugee applications and their temporary residence while their claims to asylum are being assessed. At the heart of the dispute between Italy and other countries, notably Germany, is whether or not the asylum-seekers should be able to travel to other countries while they wait for their applications to be processed.

Friedrich said he would make it clear at the Monday meeting in Brussels that Italy was breaching the spirit of the Schengen agreement that allows visa-free travel between many European states.

Seren wrote:

Keep switching accounts sorry.

See everybody thinks that too. But if you actually read more about the EU and how being a member binds us to so many laws and treaties you'll see how much of what people think about visas are incorrect.

There are sites out there beyond searchlight. Sites like migrationwatch etc and yes even the EU itself which give an honest appraisal of what we in Britain are signed up to regarding asylum seekers. If you can recall back on Sky both Allakaka and myself regularly tried to tell people of exactly what asylum seekers were entitled to under EU law. And you remember the reaction that we received. I appreciate that everyone wishes to show compassion to people fleeing a war zone but seriously how can you watch services being cut to the poorest in our society whilst we hand out thousands a week to so very many asylum seekers.

I sincerely hope one day you see sassy that many of us are not racist, xenophobes at all but realize that Britain is no longer in a position financially to do this, that's all.

Seren, you have me wrong. I don't think that you are racist, a trifle xenaphobic on occasions (only a trifle), its just I see the world from a totally different perspective to you. You see borders and think that are important, I see the world and think that more important. I don't think for one minute that helping others will do anything but mean problems for us. We are going through a hard time, but it is nowhere near as hard as some other parts of the world. Yes, we need to do all we can to protect our citizens, but only up to a point. Protectionism has a price. People become insular and frightened of change and yet we are a country that has always changed. We are a people who are made up of just about every other race. It was only a few weeks ago that they found there had been far more black people in this country way back in roman times who intermarried with the then population than they ever realised. We think that our way of life is the right way, and yet in other countries, with less material things, I have seen better culture and support of others and sharing than here. I have seen love and understanding and sharing here of course, but I have also seen how we have become totally self absorbed. My OH was only saying last night, we were sat out in the garden and although there are many houses that adjoin ours we could not see anyone or hardly hear them because of the fences, that years ago those high fences would not have been there and people would interact so much more. These days most people are suspicious of those they don't know and keep to themselves. I don't think that has anything to do with immigration, I think it has a lot more to do with the way we live. We go to work in our car, so see no-one, we come home in our car, straight into the house, close the door and thats it. We sit in front of computer screens or tvs and get blasted with adverts telling us how our lives will not be worth living unless we have this or that. We are bombarded with hyped up news stories telling us how awful the rest of the world is, and very rarely showing us the real way other people live. I have seen more visciousness and hate in the eyes of people who have so much than I have ever seen in the eyes of people with nearly nothing. I am not saying the rest of the world is perfect. Far from it, there are terrible, terrible things that go on, one of them being the abuse and subjugation of women. You have a thread about the lady in Pakistan. If there were no borders all the women of the world could come together and stop things like that. It is not that long ago that in this country the Lord of the Manor had the right to take a girls virginity on her wedding night before passing her back to her husband. We got sufferage by fighting for it, but we have a small country to fight in and a relatively high standard of living, it is much harder in huge countries with less mobility to be able to come together and fight, isolating those that disagree is much easier.

I seem to have ranted away and strayed completely from the point. Yes I think the people of this country need protecting, no, I don't think we can have unlimited immigration, our size precludes it, but I also think that we should deal with this without allowing hatred to seep in, and we can only do that if our governments and authorities also deal with it with common sense and not by allowing it to become 'for' or 'anti' britishness, whatever that might be.

I prefer the day's when we used to defend our shore's against "invaders"!

Nice sound bite from Teresa May though, as when the EU forces us to take "our fair share" of these people, she can say that the Government didn't want to take them, but were over-ruled by the EU!

MrDoodles wrote:I prefer the day's when we used to defend our shore's against "invaders"!

Nice sound bite from Teresa May though, as when the EU forces us to take "our fair share" of these people, she can say that the Government didn't want to take them, but were over-ruled by the EU!

You do Mr D, I doubt you would have done if you lived through it, we used to loose a lot of the time, hence the Roman, Norse etc etc etc blood in our veins!

MrDoodles wrote:I prefer the day's when we used to defend our shore's against "invaders"!

Nice sound bite from Teresa May though, as when the EU forces us to take "our fair share" of these people, she can say that the Government didn't want to take them, but were over-ruled by the EU!

Agreed MrD, it's quite shameful how Theresa May is lying through her teeth hoping to gather support for the Tories days before an election. Unfortunately many people still believe that the British government has any kind of control over our borders as opposed to the EU.

sassy1261 wrote:

Seren, you have me wrong. I don't think that you are racist,

Glad to hear it.

a trifle xenaphobic on occasions (only a trifle),

Xenophobia is defined as the "hatred or fear of foreigners or strangers or of their politics or culture"

Well I disagree with you here. It’s fairly well documented that I love both the Hindu religion and also Buddhism, adore the Caribbean culture and am so obsessed with Italian culture that my daughter has an Italian name, I kid you not. It was either that or a Russian name, another culture that I have obsessed about over the years, its got an amazing past and I would live to go there.

its just I see the world from a totally different perspective to you. You see borders and think that are important,

No not really, I see money, taken out of my salary month after month, year after year, and would like a say in how it is spent, that’s all. Am all for no borders but if you have no borders then surely the same tax rules for all, the same justice for all, the same healthcare for all. Do you understand what I’m saying here.

I see the world and think that more important.

I think my years of campaigning for wildlife conservation across the globe and my promotion of renewable green energy to replace fossil fuels and nuclear, sometimes in the face of hostile opposition, must surely show I care about our world, our planet.

I don't think for one minute that helping others will do anything but mean problems for us.

Please elaborate, problems for who and what problems, what students facing £43k debt, children eating less, please elaborate here.

We are going through a hard time, but it is nowhere near as hard as some other parts of the world. Yes, we need to do all we can to protect our citizens, but only up to a point.

Allowing the British economy and social structure to fail will not help anybody abroad, nobody will get anything then will it.

Protectionism has a price. People become insular and frightened of change and yet we are a country that has always changed. We are a people who are made up of just about every other race. It was only a few weeks ago that they found there had been far more black people in this country way back in roman times who intermarried with the then population than they ever realised. We think that our way of life is the right way, and yet in other countries, with less material things, I have seen better culture and support of others and sharing than here.

I think you’re talking about capitalism here aren’t you. Could you please be more specific about these countries.

You are aware of the difference in say infant mortality. Are you willing to trade then?

I have seen love and understanding and sharing here of course, but I have also seen how we have become totally self absorbed. My OH was only saying last night, we were sat out in the garden and although there are many houses that adjoin ours we could not see anyone or hardly hear them because of the fences, that years ago those high fences would not have been there and people would interact so much more. These days most people are suspicious of those they don't know and keep to themselves. I don't think that has anything to do with immigration, I think it has a lot more to do with the way we live.

It’s to do with crime sassy, simple as that. Its nothing to do with immigration.

We go to work in our car, so see no-one, we come home in our car, straight into the house, close the door and thats it. We sit in front of computer screens or tvs and get blasted with adverts telling us how our lives will not be worth living unless we have this or that.

Capitalism again, I always turn the sound off for ads myself, always had done. Actually in my family’s homes there’s music, games, BBQ’s with guests, family meals, birthday parties, days out swimming, the beach. Many many families do live great lives, yes they work hard and are more materialistic than stone age man but hey they’re happy aren’t they.

We are bombarded with hyped up news stories telling us how awful the rest of the world is, and very rarely showing us the real way other people live.

News is always bad, why report on some feel good story when you have people getting shot in Libya or some teachers striking.

Our modern communication is fantastic. We can make friends through the internet with people on the other side of the world. We can watch fascinating programs about cultures thousands of miles away. Maybe Bob and Sue next door are just a little boring after that. Not so much suspicion and hate as just humdrum. Ever thought of that?

I have seen more visciousness and hate in the eyes of people who have so much than I have ever seen in the eyes of people with nearly nothing.

I rarely see hate in peoples eyes but there again I do live in Paradise.

I am not saying the rest of the world is perfect. Far from it, there are terrible, terrible things that go on, one of them being the abuse and subjugation of women. You have a thread about the lady in Pakistan. If there were no borders all the women of the world could come together and stop things like that. It is not that long ago that in this country the Lord of the Manor had the right to take a girls virginity on her wedding night before passing her back to her husband. We got sufferage by fighting for it, but we have a small country to fight in and a relatively high standard of living, it is much harder in huge countries with less mobility to be able to come together and fight, isolating those that disagree is much easier.

Like I stated previously, if our western culture fails, if it is utterly swamped by too much immigration, too much reliance upon dwindling oil stocks then who will feed the rest of the world. Whose doctors will travel there to provide the most basic healthcare and vaccination programs to ensure that children can see despite some of the most virulent forms of eye diseases there, the re-emergence of contagious fatal fevers and virus’s eradicated by Western doctors here.

Who will provide all this if we fail?

I seem to have ranted away and strayed completely from the point. Yes I think the people of this country need protecting, no, I don't think we can have unlimited immigration, our size precludes it, but I also think that we should deal with this without allowing hatred to seep in, and we can only do that if our governments and authorities also deal with it with common sense and not by allowing it to become 'for' or 'anti' britishness, whatever that might be.

Its not about hatred though sassy with me its about responsibility. I as a parent take on all the worry and stress of paying for our home, car, food, holidays, clothes and entertainment. This allows my child to just enjoy her childhood. I never let her see me worry about a bill or rising prices. Yes our culture has the history, the resources, the intelligence to really tackle the planet’s problems and issues. Just think only a few decades ago the idea of wildlife conservation, climate change, environmentalism weren’t mainstream. We thought as a culture we could continue to use our planet’s resources as we were with no repercussions. But now look at us, using our best minds and pooling our resources to tackle these big issues using… GM foods, new energy sources, etc.

So yes our culture, our country, our identity is important. Not just to us but to the world.

Possibly people are slightly confused about attitudes to foreigners. I have travelled widely about the world and have visited many countries and enjoyed their culture and customs. I personally have no problem with those people as long as they don't come here!. We as a country are full up and skint.