Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Sun May 06, 2012 5:41 pm

In A Flap wrote:

yes indeed you have diverted away from the OP 3 times, probably more, but then that's you MO isn't it.

So you agree that merv is right in what he says???? as that seems to be what you are asking.
But it is not what the thread is about.

It's about the 1 million who went on the dole unnecessarily.

and I have shown you repeatedly time and time again that unemployment was rising from 2005.
just as it was falling from around 1992/3 to about 2001/2 where it levelled out.
You must remember all those graphs.
the one that was especially good was the one that showed labour left unemployment higher than when they came to power.




you must remember that one, a smidge more than .75% more unemployed than when they took power.


slightly less than the tories left after 18 years


the difference of course the tories inherited rising unemployment and left it falling and labour did the opposite.


just as a bit of fun I thought we would include only the last 13 years of the tory administration so we could compare like with like





I do hope you enjoyed those graphs, I love a good graph. A picture paints a thousand words.

Thanks very much for posting these graphs which show nothing new and just confirms what we already knew.

As you can see from the first graph unemployment from 2005 up to the banking collapse was not going up 'constantly' as you claim. Indeed from 2006 it was going back down again and at the point where the sh!t hit the fan it had gone back down again to the levels of around 2003 so you're going up 'constantly'[ claim is incorrect. Try using this graph as it allows you to pinpoint the precise rate in the chart at any given time.

http://www.google.co.uk/publicdata/explore?ds=z8o7pt6rd5uqa6_&met_y=unemployment_rate&idim=country:uk&fdim_y=seasonality:sa&dl=en&hl=en&q=uk+unemployment+graph

One thing your graphs do show is that never at any time did unemployment levels since 1997 ever reach the disgraceful levels of the early eighties and nineties when the Tories were saying unemployment was a price worth paying.

Wonderful things graphs and as I have just demonstrated when used properly they can be very effective in proving a point in that the huge rise in unemployment from 2008 was down to the recession which you agreed was not all Labour's fault..

BTW did you pick year 2005 because that was the last time you voted Labour? It also appears that TTS's qustion has been avswered and you do rent your bandwagon. First you vote Tory, then you vote Labour from 1997 up to but not beyond 2005 and then you vote Tory again and now you're heading off to UKIP.

Bit of a wanderer aren't you?

Laughing



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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Sun May 06, 2012 9:17 pm

In A Flap wrote:

where did I say that. You do love to read what you want into statements.

As usual you once again refused to answer anything while demanding others do so.
I said it was not ALL labours fault,
that surely implies that part of it was labours fault.


Now when will you answer a question as I have been so very obliging on answering all yours over the last 4 years, and I am still waiting for you to answer one of mine.
Was merv right that labour made 1 million people unemployed unnecessarily?

Hang on, you said it in response to this comment......

Enter Mervyn King, who used a newspaper interview directly to contradict Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault. He argued sensibly that, instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector.

You said Merv was right and he's saying "instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector".

I have answered all your questions but your answer on whether you agree that the bailouts was the correct decision is still outstanding.



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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by TTS on Sun May 06, 2012 9:59 pm

In A Flap wrote:

no it is becasue it is more fun battering left wing poodles like you all over the court.

hows the secret and cunning id by the way?????
You couldn't batter your way out of a wet paper bag FFS
it is you who keep blithely stating that no one ever gives you answers especially us
yet you have never answered any of our questions you just ignore them
and all ways have done
but if your to stupid to comprehend an answer when its given that` hardly our fault maybe meshat being in the education field could give you some pointers on comprehension after you let her of the treadmill to earn that trip to Paris
but hey! its not that you don`t understand is it


As you put it "it is more fun battering left wing poodles"

however the admission that you are trolling is something the admin should look at
instead of debate all you seek is to cause trouble and shit stir that`s the measure of the real man you are

but now you have your own site where i hear abuse name calling and bullying is the nature of the beast
yet you still find time to come and have to shit stir with the only few people you couldn't get to join

what a silly little self confessed troll you are
now slither of back to your hole ..............



its a pity that you are so bent on being antagonistic

but no matter i do antagonistic back quite well

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Drinky on Mon May 07, 2012 12:33 am

The only jobs which the lefties think are good are public sector jobs. State control. Labour did create an extra million state employees which is why we have a huge deficit paying their wages.

The fact we have to tax the private sector to death to pay for them is irrelevant it will be much much worse if Labour gets back in.

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by In A Flap on Mon May 07, 2012 10:44 am

Irn Bru wrote:

Hang on, you said it in response to this comment......

Enter Mervyn King, who used a newspaper interview directly to contradict Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault. He argued sensibly that, instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector.

You said Merv was right and he's saying "instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector".

I have answered all your questions but your answer on whether you agree that the bailouts was the correct decision is still outstanding.



I am not sure you have answered a question ever in your life.
I still have no idea if you agree with mervs assertion and the thread in general that labour put 1million people on teh dole unnecessarily.
you as usual seem to be saying merv is right when it proves what you want to prove, but he is wrong when it goes against your beliefs.
SO can I get this this straight and without your wriggling away again, Merv is wrong when he say those 1million people need not have been put on the dole by labour?????

one question at a time seems to be the only thing you can cope with so just answer that one in plain english please. you may well have answered it before but sadly I could not pick the answer out from all the other dross you constantly speak.

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Drinky on Mon May 07, 2012 3:09 pm

Now the Socialists have taken over in France we can see first hand how a Socialist administration will be greeted by the markets. Hollande has the same view as Ed Balls lets see how well he copes with doubled or even treble interest rates.

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Mon May 07, 2012 7:20 pm

In A Flap wrote:

I am not sure you have answered a question ever in your life.
I still have no idea if you agree with mervs assertion and the thread in general that labour put 1million people on teh dole unnecessarily.
you as usual seem to be saying merv is right when it proves what you want to prove, but he is wrong when it goes against your beliefs.
SO can I get this this straight and without your wriggling away again, Merv is wrong when he say those 1million people need not have been put on the dole by labour?????

one question at a time seems to be the only thing you can cope with so just answer that one in plain english please. you may well have answered it before but sadly I could not pick the answer out from all the other dross you constantly speak.

I have answered your questions but here you are again, making things up and just resorting to lying. It's your trademark right enough but never mind, I'm well used to it by now.

Face it, this thread has backfired on you big time and has blown up in your face as has your diversion claiming that unemployment rose 'constantly' since 2005. Still, we'll press on in the hope that you will eventually say whether Mervyn King's statement is right or wrong.
And if you had bothered to read what's been written you would have seen that I have answered your question so now it's time for you to answer what I have been asking you throughout this thread. So, just so that I can get this straight with no more wriggling and no more dodging from you .....

Was the decision to bail out the banks the correct one?

PS thanks for the graphs - most helpful.

Laughing

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Mon May 07, 2012 7:24 pm

Drinky wrote:Now the Socialists have taken over in France we can see first hand how a Socialist administration will be greeted by the markets. Hollande has the same view as Ed Balls lets see how well he copes with doubled or even treble interest rates.

Hi Drinky,

Did In A Flap call you in to try and divert this thread away from discussing the thread title?

And just for the record - do you have a view on it?


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Drinky on Mon May 07, 2012 7:35 pm

I believe that Socialsm destroys jobs by creating non jobs. It seeks to create state employees reliant on the state which have to be financed from over taxing the income producers.

It creates a vicious circle of debt and deficits. Labour created well over half a million public sector jbs many of which were not adding value. In order to finance the wages and pensions they relied heavily on an economy overheating on debt and banks that were not functioning in a sensibke manner.

They have learned nothing and according to Ed would resume spending at at an even greater level.

Madness. It merely mortgages the future.

As for my input it wasn't at the request of flap. God knws though you need some rw input indeed if you want debate. I have never had you as one of the Socialist who would prefer to lock up dissidents who don't subscribe to the party view.

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Mon May 07, 2012 8:01 pm

Drinky wrote:I believe that Socialsm destroys jobs by creating non jobs. It seeks to create state employees reliant on the state which have to be financed from over taxing the income producers.

It creates a vicious circle of debt and deficits. Labour created well over half a million public sector jbs many of which were not adding value. In order to finance the wages and pensions they relied heavily on an economy overheating on debt and banks that were not functioning in a sensibke manner.

They have learned nothing and according to Ed would resume spending at at an even greater level.

Madness. It merely mortgages the future.

As for my input it wasn't at the request of flap. God knws though you need some rw input indeed if you want debate. I have never had you as one of the Socialist who would prefer to lock up dissidents who don't subscribe to the party view.

I'm quite happy to dabate on issues that are of interest to me. This thread is about Mervyn King's statement on the effects of the bailout - do you have a view on it?


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Drinky on Mon May 07, 2012 9:01 pm

OK Brown gave the Bank of England but removed its teeth at the same time. It was an illusion.

The Banks fed an insatible hunger for persal debt and were massively undercapitalised as a result. The Socialist got was spending like there was no to morrow. The outcome another bust.

Some of the bail outs were poltcal eg. Northern rock. Some like RBS essential. That is my view.

For the record I also renenber Gordon was frozen in terror like a rabbit in the headlights. It was Alistar Darling who held his nerve.

In essence the govts lust from money blinded them to the lunacy of the banks actions.

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Angry Andy on Mon May 07, 2012 9:10 pm

At last, an admission from Drinky that Darling wasn't the inept buffoon he has been spouting about for years.
Compared to Darling, Osborne looks like a retarded maggot , but not as popular.

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Mon May 07, 2012 9:13 pm

Drinky wrote:OK Brown gave the Bank of England but removed its teeth at the same time. It was an illusion.

The Banks fed an insatible hunger for persal debt and were massively undercapitalised as a result. The Socialist got was spending like there was no to morrow. The outcome another bust.

Some of the bail outs were poltcal eg. Northern rock. Some like RBS essential. That is my view.

For the record I also renenber Gordon was frozen in terror like a rabbit in the headlights. It was Alistar Darling who held his nerve.

In essence the govts lust from money blinded them to the lunacy of the banks actions.

But the governments spending was no greater than the previous Tory government and the Tories in opposition promised to match Labour's spending plans.

And they were also dead against any further regulation of the banks and indeed they were calling for further deregulation to protect the city from becoming second fiddle to Frankfurt.

The Tories were in this up to their necks but since the collapse they try to rewrite history as if they were all against what was going on. Even Cameron admitted that was their poisition.

Fair enough though, Drinky, you have given your position on the bailouts and your views on the mess we are in.which is your right.


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by In A Flap on Tue May 08, 2012 9:48 am

somehow I think 10 second Tom has forgotten what this thread is actually about as he diverted from the very first post

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/9242161/Labour-lost-a-million-jobs-says-Bank-chief.html


More than a million people may have lost their jobs unnecessarily because the Labour Government failed to act on warnings from the Bank of England which could have prevented the recession, Sir Mervyn King claims.


(TST This is what the thread is about)

The Bank governor claimed that action by Gordon Brown’s administration had been “too late” to prevent the banking crisis causing a recession, which led to the sharp increase in unemployment.

Sir Mervyn said that he argued “from the beginning of 2008” that British banks required more than £100 billion of extra funding to avert a crisis.

Mr Brown and other senior ministers failed to bail out the banks until October 2008, which was “too late to prevent the financial crisis from spilling over into the world economy”, he claimed.

He said that the delay in intervening, and the subsequent recession led to unemployment in Britain rising by over a million people.

“To many of you this will seem deeply unfair, and it is,” Sir Mervyn said in a BBC lecture broadcast last night. “I can understand why so many people are angry.”


The political intervention by the Bank governor is extremely unusual and came just hours before millions of Britons are due to vote today in local and mayoral elections.

The comments are expected to be seized upon by David Cameron and George Osborne to further undermine Labour’s economic record.

Sir Mervyn urged the current government to swiftly introduce banking laws to prevent a repeat of the 2008 crisis, which has led to the deepest recession in Britain for a generation.

(that would suggest that the current laws introduced by labour are not fit for purpose)

In the lecture last night, the Bank governor disclosed details of internal wranglings over the Government’s response to the banking crisis. He said: “In August 2007 came the moment when financial markets began to realise that the emperor had no clothes.

From the start of the crisis, central banks provided emergency loans but these amounted to little more than holding a sheet in front of the emperor to conceal the nakedness of the banks. They didn’t solve the underlying problem – banks needed not loans but injections of shareholders’ capital in order to be able to absorb losses from the risky investments they had made. From the beginning of 2008, we at the Bank of England began to argue that UK banks needed extra capital – a lot of extra capital, possibly £100 billion or more. It wasn’t a popular message.”

Sir Mervyn said the “bold action” to largely nationalise RBS and Lloyds Banking Group took another nine months.

“That bold action in October 2008 could have happened sooner,” he said. “Bailing out the banks came too late to prevent the financial crisis from spilling over into the world economy. The realisation of the true state of the banking system led to a collapse of confidence around the world and a deep global recession. Over 25 million jobs disappeared worldwide. And unemployment in Britain rose by over a million.”

In his first public comments since figures showed that Britain is suffering a double-dip recession, the governor urges politicians not to delay new legislation which means banks will have to separate risky investment banking operations from consumers’ money.

His allegations are likely to anger Mr Brown. The Labour Government’s bail-out of British banks was regarded as an innovative scheme which provided a blueprint for other countries. It was seen as one of the few successful policies of Mr Brown’s short-lived premiership.

The Bank governor is due to retire next year and his analysis of the banking crisis may prompt allegations that he is attempting to “rewrite” history to paint his own role in a more favourable light.


(I suspect that this last paragraph will be siezed on by some as their get out of jail free card)

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by In A Flap on Tue May 08, 2012 9:51 am

I think you asked me when I would reply to your original diversion(your first post in this thread), well I answered you in the very next post



Thank you
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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Fri May 04, 2012 11:18 pm
+
-

In A Flap wrote:

calm down dear
I am only posting what steady eddie is saying.
the undeniable fact is that during labours last few years they put 1 million on the dole. There must have been a reason for that. could it have been their policies that caused 1 million extra to go on the dole.

Steady Eddie seems to suggest that those people need not have lost their jobs.



Merv is always right then, is he? What about this one?

Enter Mervyn King, who used a newspaper interview directly to contradict Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault. He argued sensibly that, instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector.

So has Merv convinced you now that the bailout was correct - albeit he said it could have come sooner - but nevertheless it was the correct decision, and also that the recesion was not Labour's fault?

What do you say? Is he right or is he wrong?


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by In A Flap on Sat May 05, 2012 9:45 am

Irn Bru wrote:

Merv is always right then, is he? What about this one?

Enter Mervyn King, who used a newspaper interview directly to contradict Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault. He argued sensibly that, instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector.

So has Merv convinced you now that the bailout was correct - albeit he said it could have come sooner - but nevertheless it was the correct decision, and also that the recesion was not Labour's fault?

What do you say? Is he right or is he wrong?



I am sure that Merv is right that the recession is not ALL labours fault and it is good to see that you agree that labour put 1 million people on the dole unnecessarily.

when did merv the swerve write those comments by the way?

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by In A Flap on Tue May 08, 2012 9:55 am

Angry Andy wrote:At last, an admission from Drinky that Darling wasn't the inept buffoon he has been spouting about for years.
Compared to Darling, Osborne looks like a retarded maggot , but not as popular.

I think you will find that many of us on this side have said Darling was the only honest one in the cabinet at the time. After all he said that labour would have to cut far deeper than Thatcher in their next term, and was promptly slapped down by the buffoon and incompetent Brown.


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Angry Andy on Tue May 08, 2012 10:57 am

No one has cenied there are cuts that need to be made.
It is like pulling teeth getting the point made that Osborne has got it badly wrong ( there are now fewer and fewer who believe he is correct).
Rather than clearing the debt in one term, Labour, have stated that the reductiion would be spread out over a longer period - even as long as 10 years, BUT AT THE SAME TIME creating an economy that will create REAL, manufacturing and service industry jobs.
The latest reports are that unemployment will not peak until 2016.
At what point does unemployment become NOT worth the price?
3 million? 4 million? 5 million?

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by In A Flap on Tue May 08, 2012 12:38 pm

Angry Andy wrote:No one has cenied there are cuts that need to be made.
It is like pulling teeth getting the point made that Osborne has got it badly wrong ( there are now fewer and fewer who believe he is correct).
Rather than clearing the debt in one term, Labour, have stated that the reductiion would be spread out over a longer period - even as long as 10 years, BUT AT THE SAME TIME creating an economy that will create REAL, manufacturing and service industry jobs.
The latest reports are that unemployment will not peak until 2016.
At what point does unemployment become NOT worth the price?
3 million? 4 million? 5 million?

labour stated that they would halve the deficit in the first term before the election, a goal the coalition are trying to achieve and failing as well.
the problem with the current labour front bench is they refuse to accept any culpability in what happened in their last term.
the people who were responsible for that disaster are still the ones who are saying we can borrow our way out of debt.
the debt will not be cleared for decades, no one has mentioned the debt. too many people confuse debt with deficit.the £40 odd billion we are paying to service the debt interest is part of the reason that the deficit is still so increasingly high. the continuing crisis in the eurozone is also partly the cause of the continuing recession.

thankfully so far the coalition has not put anywhere near the number of people out of work as labour did in its last 5 years.


It is the massive debts that we have that are the biggest problem for this country and that debt will take generations to remove.


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Angry Andy on Tue May 08, 2012 4:17 pm

The WW2 debt took over 50 years to clear, Dean, but during that time Britain built up , then Thatcher destroyed, a healthy industrial base.
It can be done again - although I would go for a much shorter mortgage - 15 years tops, which gives the country breathing space to rebuild the economy and growth without the effect of 4-5 million potentially unemployed.

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by TTS on Tue May 08, 2012 6:18 pm

In A Flap wrote:somehow I think 10 second Tom has forgotten what this thread is actually about as he diverted from the very first post

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/9242161/Labour-lost-a-million-jobs-says-Bank-chief.html


More than a million people may have lost their jobs unnecessarily because the Labour Government failed to act on warnings from the Bank of England which could have prevented the recession, Sir Mervyn King claims.


(TST This is what the thread is about)

The Bank governor claimed that action by Gordon Brown’s administration had been “too late” to prevent the banking crisis causing a recession, which led to the sharp increase in unemployment.

Sir Mervyn said that he argued “from the beginning of 2008” that British banks required more than £100 billion of extra funding to avert a crisis.

Mr Brown and other senior ministers failed to bail out the banks until October 2008, which was “too late to prevent the financial crisis from spilling over into the world economy”, he claimed.

He said that the delay in intervening, and the subsequent recession led to unemployment in Britain rising by over a million people.

“To many of you this will seem deeply unfair, and it is,” Sir Mervyn said in a BBC lecture broadcast last night. “I can understand why so many people are angry.”


The political intervention by the Bank governor is extremely unusual and came just hours before millions of Britons are due to vote today in local and mayoral elections.

The comments are expected to be seized upon by David Cameron and George Osborne to further undermine Labour’s economic record.

Sir Mervyn urged the current government to swiftly introduce banking laws to prevent a repeat of the 2008 crisis, which has led to the deepest recession in Britain for a generation.

(that would suggest that the current laws introduced by labour are not fit for purpose)

In the lecture last night, the Bank governor disclosed details of internal wranglings over the Government’s response to the banking crisis. He said: “In August 2007 came the moment when financial markets began to realise that the emperor had no clothes.

From the start of the crisis, central banks provided emergency loans but these amounted to little more than holding a sheet in front of the emperor to conceal the nakedness of the banks. They didn’t solve the underlying problem – banks needed not loans but injections of shareholders’ capital in order to be able to absorb losses from the risky investments they had made. From the beginning of 2008, we at the Bank of England began to argue that UK banks needed extra capital – a lot of extra capital, possibly £100 billion or more. It wasn’t a popular message.”

Sir Mervyn said the “bold action” to largely nationalise RBS and Lloyds Banking Group took another nine months.

“That bold action in October 2008 could have happened sooner,” he said. “Bailing out the banks came too late to prevent the financial crisis from spilling over into the world economy. The realisation of the true state of the banking system led to a collapse of confidence around the world and a deep global recession. Over 25 million jobs disappeared worldwide. And unemployment in Britain rose by over a million.”

In his first public comments since figures showed that Britain is suffering a double-dip recession, the governor urges politicians not to delay new legislation which means banks will have to separate risky investment banking operations from consumers’ money.

His allegations are likely to anger Mr Brown. The Labour Government’s bail-out of British banks was regarded as an innovative scheme which provided a blueprint for other countries. It was seen as one of the few successful policies of Mr Brown’s short-lived premiership.

The Bank governor is due to retire next year and his analysis of the banking crisis may prompt allegations that he is attempting to “rewrite” history to paint his own role in a more favourable light.


(I suspect that this last paragraph will be siezed on by some as their get out of jail free card)
as is your want
you take a statement and blow it up in to something its not
as you have repeatedly pointed Mr king said "may have lost their jobs unnecessarily" the operative word there is MAY
not DID loose their jobs or indeed HAVE lost their jobs

So this whole op by you is pointless

As is about a opinion not a fact
you may say that the discussion is about whether its true ....but no wait a minute that would mean discussing related events ,comments and facts
And you have all ready accused people of dragging it of topic because they tried to put the op and answer in context



But why your still seem to fighting the last general election is a matter of constant amusement to me and i suspect many others


But i guess that`s all you have
since your guys david and George have completely broken every thing they have touched
but i guess you won`t be supporting them next time not that your vote matters their out any way


but its nice you keep coming back to visit



seems to me opposing the bail outs to me

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Tue May 08, 2012 7:59 pm

In A Flap wrote:somehow I think 10 second Tom has forgotten what this thread is actually about as he diverted from the very first post

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financialcrisis/9242161/Labour-lost-a-million-jobs-says-Bank-chief.html


More than a million people may have lost their jobs unnecessarily because the Labour Government failed to act on warnings from the Bank of England which could have prevented the recession, Sir Mervyn King claims.


(TST This is what the thread is about)

The Bank governor claimed that action by Gordon Brown’s administration had been “too late” to prevent the banking crisis causing a recession, which led to the sharp increase in unemployment.

Sir Mervyn said that he argued “from the beginning of 2008” that British banks required more than £100 billion of extra funding to avert a crisis.

Mr Brown and other senior ministers failed to bail out the banks until October 2008, which was “too late to prevent the financial crisis from spilling over into the world economy”, he claimed.

He said that the delay in intervening, and the subsequent recession led to unemployment in Britain rising by over a million people.

“To many of you this will seem deeply unfair, and it is,” Sir Mervyn said in a BBC lecture broadcast last night. “I can understand why so many people are angry.”


The political intervention by the Bank governor is extremely unusual and came just hours before millions of Britons are due to vote today in local and mayoral elections.

The comments are expected to be seized upon by David Cameron and George Osborne to further undermine Labour’s economic record.

Sir Mervyn urged the current government to swiftly introduce banking laws to prevent a repeat of the 2008 crisis, which has led to the deepest recession in Britain for a generation.

(that would suggest that the current laws introduced by labour are not fit for purpose)

In the lecture last night, the Bank governor disclosed details of internal wranglings over the Government’s response to the banking crisis. He said: “In August 2007 came the moment when financial markets began to realise that the emperor had no clothes.

From the start of the crisis, central banks provided emergency loans but these amounted to little more than holding a sheet in front of the emperor to conceal the nakedness of the banks. They didn’t solve the underlying problem – banks needed not loans but injections of shareholders’ capital in order to be able to absorb losses from the risky investments they had made. From the beginning of 2008, we at the Bank of England began to argue that UK banks needed extra capital – a lot of extra capital, possibly £100 billion or more. It wasn’t a popular message.”

Sir Mervyn said the “bold action” to largely nationalise RBS and Lloyds Banking Group took another nine months.

“That bold action in October 2008 could have happened sooner,” he said. “Bailing out the banks came too late to prevent the financial crisis from spilling over into the world economy. The realisation of the true state of the banking system led to a collapse of confidence around the world and a deep global recession. Over 25 million jobs disappeared worldwide. And unemployment in Britain rose by over a million.”

In his first public comments since figures showed that Britain is suffering a double-dip recession, the governor urges politicians not to delay new legislation which means banks will have to separate risky investment banking operations from consumers’ money.

His allegations are likely to anger Mr Brown. The Labour Government’s bail-out of British banks was regarded as an innovative scheme which provided a blueprint for other countries. It was seen as one of the few successful policies of Mr Brown’s short-lived premiership.

The Bank governor is due to retire next year and his analysis of the banking crisis may prompt allegations that he is attempting to “rewrite” history to paint his own role in a more favourable light.


(I suspect that this last paragraph will be siezed on by some as their get out of jail free card)

Is Mervyn King correct in that the bailouts were the correct decision but they should have been done sooner to save 1 million jobs? Do you agree with him?

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Tue May 08, 2012 8:10 pm

In A Flap wrote:I think you asked me when I would reply to your original diversion(your first post in this thread), well I answered you in the very next post



Thank you
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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Fri May 04, 2012 11:18 pm
+
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In A Flap wrote:

calm down dear
I am only posting what steady eddie is saying.
the undeniable fact is that during labours last few years they put 1 million on the dole. There must have been a reason for that. could it have been their policies that caused 1 million extra to go on the dole.

Steady Eddie seems to suggest that those people need not have lost their jobs.



Merv is always right then, is he? What about this one?

Enter Mervyn King, who used a newspaper interview directly to contradict Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault. He argued sensibly that, instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector.

So has Merv convinced you now that the bailout was correct - albeit he said it could have come sooner - but nevertheless it was the correct decision, and also that the recesion was not Labour's fault?

What do you say? Is he right or is he wrong?


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by In A Flap on Sat May 05, 2012 9:45 am

Irn Bru wrote:

Merv is always right then, is he? What about this one?

Enter Mervyn King, who used a newspaper interview directly to contradict Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault. He argued sensibly that, instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector.

So has Merv convinced you now that the bailout was correct - albeit he said it could have come sooner - but nevertheless it was the correct decision, and also that the recesion was not Labour's fault?

What do you say? Is he right or is he wrong?



I am sure that Merv is right that the recession is not ALL labours fault and it is good to see that you agree that labour put 1 million people on the dole unnecessarily.

when did merv the swerve write those comments by the way?

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Oh dear, the lying and the twisting goes on and then you get angry and then you try to divert the thread and then you indulgei n petty name-calling. It's your hallmark right enough but I'm used to it by now.

So just to clear things up let me remind you what I posted.......

Irn Bru wrote:

Merv is always right then, is he? What about this one?

Enter Mervyn King, who used a newspaper interview directly to contradict Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault. He argued sensibly that, instead, the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector.

So has Merv convinced you now that the bailout was correct - albeit he said it could have come sooner - but nevertheless it was the correct decision, and also that the recesion was not Labour's fault?

What do you say? Is he right or is he wrong?


You didn't even understand that Mervyn King was contracdicting Osborne's claim that the recession was all Labour's fault, he was saying that instead the blame lay with the banks and the financial sector. And your answer dodged the question about the bailouts but I've highlighted and underlined the bit you dodged .

We're on page 4 now but we'll press om in the hope that you will have an opinion and answer the question.

So that I can get this straight with no more wriggling and no more dodging from you .....

Was the decision to bail out the banks the correct one?


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Tue May 08, 2012 8:56 pm

In A Flap wrote:

labour stated that they would halve the deficit in the first term before the election, a goal the coalition are trying to achieve and failing as well.
the problem with the current labour front bench is they refuse to accept any culpability in what happened in their last term.
the people who were responsible for that disaster are still the ones who are saying we can borrow our way out of debt.
the debt will not be cleared for decades, no one has mentioned the debt. too many people confuse debt with deficit.the £40 odd billion we are paying to service the debt interest is part of the reason that the deficit is still so increasingly high. the continuing crisis in the eurozone is also partly the cause of the continuing recession.

thankfully so far the coalition has not put anywhere near the number of people out of work as labour did in its last 5 years.


It is the massive debts that we have that are the biggest problem for this country and that debt will take generations to remove.


There is a refusal by anyone to accept culpability for what has been going on over the past 30 odd years as all the parties signed up to a cozy economic consensus.

The failures are not just on the Labour front bench because you can see them also sitting on the government fron bench. Hague and Duncan Smith are both failed Tory leaders and Cameron was a financial advisor to Norman Lamont during the ERM scandal when billions were lost in just one day.
And remember, up to the financial collapse caused by the bankers, Cameron and Osborne was promising to match Labour's spending plans and they were prompting the government to further deregulate the banks and follow the example of Ireland in running the economy only for Osborne to have to bail them out with 7 billion of UK taxpayers money.

What a couple of clowns and here you are realising that having jumped from voting Tory to voting Labour and then voting Tory again your now needing to head off in the direction of UKIP for a solution.

The banks call the shots and that's where the culpability for the mess and the unemployment levels lie and until they are sorted out not much will change and they will just laugh behind your back as you do their work for them by being suckered into pumping out the message that it was all Labour's fault.

Here, fix your eyes on this...


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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Irn Bru on Tue May 08, 2012 9:14 pm

TTS wrote:as is your want
you take a statement and blow it up in to something its not
as you have repeatedly pointed Mr king said "may have lost their jobs unnecessarily" the operative word there is MAY
not DID loose their jobs or indeed HAVE lost their jobs

So this whole op by you is pointless

As is about a opinion not a fact
you may say that the discussion is about whether its true ....but no wait a minute that would mean discussing related events ,comments and facts
And you have all ready accused people of dragging it of topic because they tried to put the op and answer in context



But why your still seem to fighting the last general election is a matter of constant amusement to me and i suspect many others


But i guess that`s all you have
since your guys david and George have completely broken every thing they have touched
but i guess you won`t be supporting them next time not that your vote matters their out any way


but its nice you keep coming back to visit



seems to me opposing the bail outs to me

He won't say whether Mervyn King is right or wrong on the very thread title that he started - what a strange chappy.

Laughing

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Re: Labour lost a million jobs, says Bank chief

Post by Angry Andy on Tue May 08, 2012 9:30 pm

Dean is flipping and flapping more than ever.
It is all a bit like the Fonz, trying to say I'm s.s.s.s.s.o...orry!
He just won't admit that it wasn't entirely Labour's fault for the financial crisis, even though the likes of Drinky and moletrousers are coming round to admitting it.

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