Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:26 pm

elektrafied wrote:

mmmm...would you care to explain how the universe, this planet and life started.... Very Happy

ok then, what do you want to know...

how we obtained the 21% oxygen mix needed to sustain life which we have had on the planet for around 100 million years now.

do you understand the chemical processes that created that unique mix which exists nowhere else in the solar system

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:27 pm

David wrote:
You are obviously not Catholic Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

no.. Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:29 pm

Seren wrote:

ok then, what do you want to know...

how we obtained the 21% oxygen mix needed to sustain life which we have had on the planet for around 100 million years now.

do you understand the chemical processes that created that unique mix which exists nowhere else in the solar system

the whole lot please from start to finish, the cosmos, the earth, first life....this should be good...

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:35 pm

elektrafied wrote:

the whole lot please from start to finish, the cosmos, the earth, first life....this should be good...

I won't bait you it's alright, I let you carry on with your debate about the tooth fairy


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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:40 pm

Seren wrote:

I won't bait you it's alright, I let you carry on with your debate about the tooth fairy


lol.thats a pretty short story.lol

I didn't think you knew anything. Very Happy

back to topic if a gay or lesbian is prepared to stop being gay or lesbian they can be saved, I think the bible makes that clear.

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:54 pm

elektrafied wrote:

there is no confusion at all, just excuses that some gays would make, it states quite clearly that no homosexual will find the kingdom of God..
What passage says no homosexual will find the kingdom of God..?

it is like all other sin you must repent, turn away from it, if you have no intentions of stopping being gay you cannot enter the kingdom of heaven...

I think you need to look at the bible again, like I say, it only relates in regards to men being with men, not women, no such verse on lesbians, also you have ignored the story of david and jonathan who were clearly in a homosexual relationship, plus you have Ruth and naomi and this later relationship is celebrated not condemned.
Plus you not see any time where Jesus says nothing about same-sex behavior, the Jewish prophets are silent about homosexuality and only six or seven of the Bible's one million verses refer to same-sex behavior in any way -- and none of these verses refer to homosexual orientation as it's understood today.

may want to have another rad of the bible and try to understand what is meant by the verses in regards to homsexuality.

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:00 pm

Phildidge wrote:

I think you need to look at the bible again, like I say, it only relates in regards to men being with men, not women, no such verse on lesbians, also you have ignored the story of david and jonathan who were clearly in a homosexual relationship, plus you have Ruth and naomi and this later relationship is celebrated not condemned.
Plus you not see any time where Jesus says nothing about same-sex behavior, the Jewish prophets are silent about homosexuality and only six or seven of the Bible's one million verses refer to same-sex behavior in any way -- and none of these verses refer to homosexual orientation as it's understood today.

may want to have another rad of the bible and try to understand what is meant by the verses in regards to homsexuality.

lol...as usual you are wrong gay and lesbians are clearly against God's will from Genesis to revelations...lol

one man given to one woman it is very clear if viewed without bias... Very Happy

the bible mentions a man loving his son are you claiming that validates pedophilia and incest... Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:03 pm

elektrafied wrote:

as I have just said there is no contradictions it is made clear homosexuals either gay or lesbians are sinning and need to repent... Very Happy

more like need a rebore Laughing

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:10 pm

elektrafied wrote:

lol...as usual you are wrong gay and lesbians are clearly against God's will from Genesis to revelations...lol
Am I, please show the verses, so we can see who is right or wrong, is simple really, saying you are right proves nothing.

one man given to one woman it is very clear if viewed without bias... Very Happy
It is clear, but where does it say anything that a woman cannot be with another woman? It doesn't, so if the bible is unclear, as this passage states only one man to one woman, even though that is a contradiction as certain people in the bible have multiple wives. Not doing to well are you?

the bible mentions a man loving his son are you claiming that validates pedophilia and incest... Very Happy

Well Mary was 12 when impreganted by God, so you may wish to take that one up with him, loving your son, is different to saying you love a male mate, but read the passages on David and Jonathan, it is very clear they were in love, I am not sure, but I don't go round telling my male mates I am in love with them, do you?
Does help if you actually read the bible before engaging in this debate! Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:17 pm

Phildidge wrote:

Well Mary was 12 when impreganted by God, so you may wish to take that one up with him, loving your son, is different to saying you love a male mate, but read the passages on David and Jonathan, it is very clear they were in love, I am not sure, but I don't go round telling my male mates I am in love with them, do you?
Does help if you actually read the bible before engaging in this debate! Very Happy

please cite the scripture that states mary was 12 years old.... Very Happy

love can be many things, did they act on that "love"...cite the scripture... Very Happy

perhaps you should practice before you so poorly preach... Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:21 pm

There is early documents not in the bible on Mary which place 2 ages one 14 the other 12, both under age, hence why the Vatican has the age of 12 for consent for marriage.

I see you did not provide any verses and did not address my points so try again, they won't go away:

Am I, please show the verses, so we can see who is right or wrong, is simple really, saying you are right proves nothing.


It is clear, but where does it say anything that a woman cannot be with another woman? It doesn't, so if the bible is unclear, as this passage states only one man to one woman, even though that is a contradiction as certain people in the bible have multiple wives. Not doing to well are you?

Well Mary was 12 when impreganted by God, so you may wish to take that one up with him, loving your son, is different to saying you love a male mate, but read the passages on David and Jonathan, it is very clear they were in love, I am not sure, but I don't go round telling my male mates I am in love with them, do you?

Plus still waiting for the verse on no homosexual will find the kingdom of God..?






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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:25 pm

Phildidge wrote:There is early documents not in the bible on Mary which place 2 ages one 14 the other 12, both under age, hence why the Vatican has the age of 12 for consent for marriage.

I see you did not provide any verses and did not address my points so try again, they won't go away:

Am I, please show the verses, so we can see who is right or wrong, is simple really, saying you are right proves nothing.


It is clear, but where does it say anything that a woman cannot be with another woman? It doesn't, so if the bible is unclear, as this passage states only one man to one woman, even though that is a contradiction as certain people in the bible have multiple wives. Not doing to well are you?

Well Mary was 12 when impreganted by God, so you may wish to take that one up with him, loving your son, is different to saying you love a male mate, but read the passages on David and Jonathan, it is very clear they were in love, I am not sure, but I don't go round telling my male mates I am in love with them, do you?

Plus still waiting for the verse on no homosexual will find the kingdom of God..?






so you don't have any scripture showing mary was twelve... Very Happy

any scripture with jonathan ... Very Happy

just your bias and speculation.... Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:34 pm

elektrafied wrote:

so you don't have any scripture showing mary was twelve... Very Happy

any scripture with jonathan ... Very Happy

just your bias and speculation.... Very Happy

So historical documents are not valid for you then, I guess we might as well dismiss Alexandra the Great then shall we?
So what age could a girl marry in the time of Jesus, answer on a postcard? Very Happy

I see you also have no wish to produce your evidence, so I guess you have no answer and no you are wrong, shame, could have been interesting, let me know if you change your mind and actually provide evidence for your claims from the bible, good luck! Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by victorismyhero on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:40 pm

Well, all I can say is that thank the lady I'm a pagan....at least we have no hangups about sin...there is no such thing, only the breaking of mans mores and laws...and no evil save that which a man (or woman) brings with them
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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:43 pm

victorismyhero wrote:Well, all I can say is that thank the lady I'm a pagan....at least we have no hangups about sin...there is no such thing, only the breaking of mans mores and laws...and no evil save that which a man (or woman) brings with them

There was human scarifice though in the past Victor?

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:44 pm

Phildidge wrote:

So historical documents are not valid for you then, I guess we might as well dismiss Alexandra the Great then shall we?

I see you also have no wish to produce your evidence, so I guess you have no answer and no you are wrong, shame, could have been interesting, let me know if you change your mind and actually provide evidence for your claims from the bible, good luck! Very Happy

you stated mary was 12, we were discussing the bible, you have no bible reference to mary's age.... Very Happy

my evidence for what oy yeah romans chapter 1 vs 26-27 inclusive... Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:45 pm

victorismyhero wrote:Well, all I can say is that thank the lady I'm a pagan....at least we have no hangups about sin...there is no such thing, only the breaking of mans mores and laws...and no evil save that which a man (or woman) brings with them

So many religions have so many hangups, and the worst seem to be about sexuality. I find it very silly, we are what we are, and made up rules and regulations to make people feel guilty don't change anything, people still feel the same.


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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:47 pm

sassy1261 wrote:

So many religions have so many hangups, and the worst seem to be about sexuality. I find it very silly, we are what we are, and made up rules and regulations to make people feel guilty don't change anything, people still feel the same.


the rules are for our own protection..

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by victorismyhero on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:50 pm

Phildidge wrote:

There was human scarifice though in the past Victor?

Yeah...and some of the "odder" versions of christianity are still at it today.......Moreover...most of us pagans have got over our past........many less "odd" christians are still to stupid to see beyond that very poorly written, entirely man made book of theirs, whilst others twist it all ways to suit them selves....like the born agains......
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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:51 pm

elektrafied wrote:

you stated mary was 12, we were discussing the bible, you have no bible reference to mary's age.... Very Happy

my evidence for what oy yeah romans chapter 1 vs 26-27 inclusive... Very Happy

Are you saying historical documents don't count? Oh my!

Anyway the verse you provided is stating something of the past, no command not to, so I suggest you try again, it states:

Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.

So no command for women, try again.

No verse on homosexuals not being allowed to paradise, again not doing so well.

Again what was the age Girls were allowed to marry in the time of Jesus, may help you understand Mary's age at conception? Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:52 pm

victorismyhero wrote:

Yeah...and some of the "odder" versions of christianity are still at it today.......Moreover...most of us pagans have got over our past........many less "odd" christians are still to stupid to see beyond that very poorly written, entirely man made book of theirs, whilst others twist it all ways to suit them selves....like the born agains......

Wasn't knocking victor, just trying to understand why, hoped you could elaborate as to why?

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by victorismyhero on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:52 pm

elektrafied wrote:

the rules are for our own protection..

yeah right.....just like the shark is to protect us from swimming Shark those "rules are there to enable monarchs kings emperors etc to control US....nothing more ...nothing less......



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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:55 pm

victorismyhero wrote:

yeah right.....just like the shark is to protect us from swimming Shark those "rules are there to enable monarchs kings emperors etc to control US....nothing more ...nothing less......




common sense rules... Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by Guest on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:56 pm

Phildidge wrote:

Are you saying historical documents don't count? Oh my!

Anyway the verse you provided is stating something of the past, no command not to, so I suggest you try again, it states:

Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.

So no command for women, try again.

No verse on homosexuals not being allowed to paradise, again not doing so well.

Again what was the age Girls were allowed to marry in the time of Jesus, may help you understand Mary's age at conception? Very Happy

Very Happy

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Re: Does the bible class homosexuality as sin?

Post by victorismyhero on Mon Oct 24, 2011 8:57 pm

Phildidge wrote:

Wasn't knocking victor, just trying to understand why, hoped you could elaborate as to why?

As to why? you mean why hunman sacrifice. Well now thats a good question...how DO we look into the mind, and thus the motivation, of societies and individuals thousands or even hundreds of years ago.
There are theories of course, and I recon the lead one atm is the one about votive offerings....throwing something precious to the gods...like a coin, weapon, etc...well human sacrifice it is thought was the extreme edge of this....what MORE precious to offer the gods than a human life.....Bear in mind too that the VALUE of human life was different then...and perhaps viewed differently too....
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